Re: [bolger] Re: EEEK!!!
I guess we interpreting the meaning of that article in our own ways. In
the first paragraph below, he's just describing the characteristics the
boat, not necessarily condemning it. I don't read it as he is saying it
dangerous. If you drop the word "Desperately" you'll see what I mean. Mr.
Bolger writes sometimes in a round about way.
In my post on EEEK!!! if you reread it you'll see I am pointing out the
advantages and improvements of the Piroque 12 over the design of EEEK!!!
Don
the first paragraph below, he's just describing the characteristics the
boat, not necessarily condemning it. I don't read it as he is saying it
dangerous. If you drop the word "Desperately" you'll see what I mean. Mr.
Bolger writes sometimes in a round about way.
In my post on EEEK!!! if you reread it you'll see I am pointing out the
advantages and improvements of the Piroque 12 over the design of EEEK!!!
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: <pvanderw@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 6:16 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: EEEK!!!
> > I'm not sure where you got that information, where was that
> statement?
>
> What exactly did Bolger write (30-Odd Boats)?
>
> On the boat without ballast:
>
> "The sides are too high to be comfortable with a double paddle, and
> they have the disconcerting effect of limiting the lean of the
> paddler's upper body. Once she gets over to a certain angle, long
> before the gunwale goes under, a paddler sitting upright has no way
> to recover. Unless he instantly drops flat on his back - an unnatural
> reaction for most - he's pulled past beam ends and spilled out into
> the water. The boat will then right herself but resist all his
> efforts to get back in from the side or either end."
>
> On the boat with ballast:
>
> "With 40 pounds on her bottom, she can be entered over bow or stern
> without resorting to the ourtrigger trick, and of course she's much
> less likely to go over in the first place. With 75 pounds, she seems
> not desperately dangerous to go alongshore in."
>
> "Not desperately dangerous" is not a ringing endorsement of safety
> where I come from. My advice is, stick to the pirogue.
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
>
>
> I'm not sure where you got that information, where was thatstatement?
What exactly did Bolger write (30-Odd Boats)?
On the boat without ballast:
"The sides are too high to be comfortable with a double paddle, and
they have the disconcerting effect of limiting the lean of the
paddler's upper body. Once she gets over to a certain angle, long
before the gunwale goes under, a paddler sitting upright has no way
to recover. Unless he instantly drops flat on his back - an unnatural
reaction for most - he's pulled past beam ends and spilled out into
the water. The boat will then right herself but resist all his
efforts to get back in from the side or either end."
On the boat with ballast:
"With 40 pounds on her bottom, she can be entered over bow or stern
without resorting to the ourtrigger trick, and of course she's much
less likely to go over in the first place. With 75 pounds, she seems
not desperately dangerous to go alongshore in."
"Not desperately dangerous" is not a ringing endorsement of safety
where I come from. My advice is, stick to the pirogue.
Peter
I'm not sure where you got that information, where was that statement?
If your are referring to his article in his book on Eeek!, the only
reference he makes to it being dangerous is if it is used without ballast.
Also, if it was dangerous that were then why would he come out with an
updated version.
I can't imagine that it would be any less safe or more tricky than
sailing some of the narrow sailing canoes. If there's a concern about
re-entry into the boat you could use a paddle float, like those used for
kayaks. Looks like fun to me.But you're right if you meaning is to sail it
only close to shore. Don
If your are referring to his article in his book on Eeek!, the only
reference he makes to it being dangerous is if it is used without ballast.
Also, if it was dangerous that were then why would he come out with an
updated version.
I can't imagine that it would be any less safe or more tricky than
sailing some of the narrow sailing canoes. If there's a concern about
re-entry into the boat you could use a paddle float, like those used for
kayaks. Looks like fun to me.But you're right if you meaning is to sail it
only close to shore. Don
----- Original Message -----
From: <pvanderw@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 8:39 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: EEEK!!!
> > The cutaway drawing of EEEK!!! was drawn a long time ago and
> > since that time Mr. Bolger has designed an updated version of
> EEEK!!!
>
> I think it would be only fair to point out that PCB plainly thought
> EEEK! to be a tricky, perhaps dangerous, little boat. It was an
> experiment, and not meant for general use.
>
> PHV
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
>
>
>
> The cutaway drawing of EEEK!!! was drawn a long time ago andEEEK!!!
> since that time Mr. Bolger has designed an updated version of
I think it would be only fair to point out that PCB plainly thought
EEEK! to be a tricky, perhaps dangerous, little boat. It was an
experiment, and not meant for general use.
PHV
This my friends is EEEK!!! as it was originally designed.
http://www.tomah.com/delliott/eeek.jpg
The cutaway drawing of EEEK!!! was drawn a long time ago and
since that time Mr. Bolger has designed an updated version of EEEK!!!
it's called the Piroque 12.
The hull form looks identical to the original EEEK!!! but Mr.
Bolger has revised a great many things in the new design. Let's
compare the two and see what he changed and try to reason why he made
the changes.
EEEK!!! `s rudder was a none kick-up type with an end plate. The
Piroque is a standard blade without the end plate that pivots up, it
is larger and goes below the hull, EEEK!!!'s was flush with the
bottom of the hull. The only assumption that can be made is that the
shallow, end-plated rudder on end plate was lacking in performance
and the larger deeper blade works a lot better.
EEEK!!! `s rudder originally was controlled by a steering link;
the Pirogue now is controlled by foot pedals. This seems like it
might be a matter of personal preference. Some people have no trouble
with a link, as in the drawing, other like foot pedals. To me the
foot pedals free up your hands for other tasks and might prove a lot
safer.
EEEK !!! `s uses a single leeboard, so does the Piroque. There is
a difference however EEEK!!! leeboard was hung on a rope; this was
changed to a fixed leeboard on one side with a bolt pivot. It saves
you getting wet moving the board and the whole operation of the board
is much simpler and more compact.
The sail rig was changed from a leg-o'- mutton with sprit boom to
a gaff rig with a standard boom. He did this probably to allow
spilling the wind quickly by freeing the gaff yard and possibly to
make reefing a lot easier.
If you look at EEEK!!! `s drawing you can see the ballast under
the sea bag. This is an aid to righting the boat in the event of a
capsize. Theirs is no clue to if the Pirogue uses any ballast at all.
Notice the flotation material located in the bow and at the stern.
This is what Mr. Bolger says of the boat. "Boats like this are a
throwback to the 19th century sailing canoes"."With the sailed
furled, drifting or at anchor, it's possible to sleep quite
comfortable in the 6 1/2 by 22 inch well."
If you would like to build the Piroque12 the complete plans are
in MAIB, Issue June 1, 1997. In that issue John Harris built one and
has this to say about it. "They tack, jibe and point convincingly.
The big rudder imparts crisp control. Speed is good. Stability is
Surprising"
Overall the revisions to EEEK!!! were made basically to make the
boat easier to operate. Don.
By the way I've started a new E-group it's called Small boats
http://www.egroups.com/group/Smallboats
It would only be of interest to the small Bolger boats and the site
is more focused on boats that are paddled, rowed or sailed in size up
to eigthteen feet. It's about there development and safety.If that is
an area that is of your interest please sign up and enjoy. Don
http://www.tomah.com/delliott/eeek.jpg
The cutaway drawing of EEEK!!! was drawn a long time ago and
since that time Mr. Bolger has designed an updated version of EEEK!!!
it's called the Piroque 12.
The hull form looks identical to the original EEEK!!! but Mr.
Bolger has revised a great many things in the new design. Let's
compare the two and see what he changed and try to reason why he made
the changes.
EEEK!!! `s rudder was a none kick-up type with an end plate. The
Piroque is a standard blade without the end plate that pivots up, it
is larger and goes below the hull, EEEK!!!'s was flush with the
bottom of the hull. The only assumption that can be made is that the
shallow, end-plated rudder on end plate was lacking in performance
and the larger deeper blade works a lot better.
EEEK!!! `s rudder originally was controlled by a steering link;
the Pirogue now is controlled by foot pedals. This seems like it
might be a matter of personal preference. Some people have no trouble
with a link, as in the drawing, other like foot pedals. To me the
foot pedals free up your hands for other tasks and might prove a lot
safer.
EEEK !!! `s uses a single leeboard, so does the Piroque. There is
a difference however EEEK!!! leeboard was hung on a rope; this was
changed to a fixed leeboard on one side with a bolt pivot. It saves
you getting wet moving the board and the whole operation of the board
is much simpler and more compact.
The sail rig was changed from a leg-o'- mutton with sprit boom to
a gaff rig with a standard boom. He did this probably to allow
spilling the wind quickly by freeing the gaff yard and possibly to
make reefing a lot easier.
If you look at EEEK!!! `s drawing you can see the ballast under
the sea bag. This is an aid to righting the boat in the event of a
capsize. Theirs is no clue to if the Pirogue uses any ballast at all.
Notice the flotation material located in the bow and at the stern.
This is what Mr. Bolger says of the boat. "Boats like this are a
throwback to the 19th century sailing canoes"."With the sailed
furled, drifting or at anchor, it's possible to sleep quite
comfortable in the 6 1/2 by 22 inch well."
If you would like to build the Piroque12 the complete plans are
in MAIB, Issue June 1, 1997. In that issue John Harris built one and
has this to say about it. "They tack, jibe and point convincingly.
The big rudder imparts crisp control. Speed is good. Stability is
Surprising"
Overall the revisions to EEEK!!! were made basically to make the
boat easier to operate. Don.
By the way I've started a new E-group it's called Small boats
http://www.egroups.com/group/Smallboats
It would only be of interest to the small Bolger boats and the site
is more focused on boats that are paddled, rowed or sailed in size up
to eigthteen feet. It's about there development and safety.If that is
an area that is of your interest please sign up and enjoy. Don