Re: [bolger] PFDs

>John, I give up, what is a squirt boat? I have seen a kayak like
>surf board with
>a shoe like cover on the bow end and open to the rear, in South
>Carolina. Clyde

Squirt boats are low volume, high performance kayak that began to
become popular in the late eighties. While a typical whitewater kayak
from that era might have a volume of 60 gallons, a squirt might be
less than 25. When you see a paddler in a squirt for the first time
it literally looks like a legless man glued to a surfboard.

Aside from extremely low volume, squirts are also distinguished by
their shape -- the ends are much like in inverted airplane wing.
Though the use of the sharp edge (chine) and negative lift (the
foil), and the complex currents, cross-current and pressure voids in
a river to do all sorts of strange things.

For example: The boat can be cut into an eddy line where the opposing
downstream and upstream currents cause the boat to flat spin along
the line of low pressure between the currents. As the boat spins,
negative lift along the two wings (the for and aft part of the
squirt,) pulls the boat down further. Properly executed, a squirt may
be pulled down to well over the paddler's head and emerge several
yards down stream. There are many other maneuvers too bizarre to
describe.

This all begs the question "Why would anyone want to do such a
thing?" and I have to admit, the first time I saw squirt boaters they
aroused fear and suspicion. But not many months later, I was one.

YIBB,

David

CRUMBLING EMPIRE PRODUCTIONS
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 243-1636
John, I give up, what is a squirt boat? I have seen a kayak like surf board with
a shoe like cover on the bow end and open to the rear, in South Carolina. Clyde

John Bell wrote:

> As a reformed squirt boater, I've got a few of these. They are comfortable
> as David says, albeit a bit hot in the summer if you are not swimming some.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David Ryan" <david@...>
> To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 11:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [bolger] PFDs
>
> | >thanks for the quick reply, Steve... I have been thinking about them for
> | >this years sailing season... But have not talked to anyone that has
> | >experience with them inflating....
> | > I always wear a regular PFD but it is uncomfortable and very hot in the
> | >late summer.......
> | >while I am a good swimmer not everyone that sails with me is... would you
> | >say that they are suitable for non swimmers?
> | >thanks
> | >Chris Flynn
> |
> |
> | Chris, you've pointed out the biggest reason why PFDs don't get used
> | -- they really get in the way.
> |
> | I may have an answer.
> |
> | There's a sub-set of kayaking called "Squirt-boating." Squirts spend
> | as much time under the water as on top, and a big-bulky vest really
> | gets in the way.
> |
> | There's a Type III vest made just for this kind of activity. I have
> | one and use it all the time. Not quite as nice as no vest at all, but
> | whenever I'm doing something with my boat that I wouldn't do on my
> | surfboard, (way off the beach,) I wear the vest. (I also have a very
> | loud whistle permanently affixed.)
> |
> | Another handy self-rescue item is a pair of flippers. In Hawaii, guys
> | who surf *really* big waves tuck a single flipper into their wetsuits
> | just incase they have to make a long swim back to the beach. A few of
> | the guys that kayak-fish out here carry them just incase.
> |
> | Although a type III vest is not as bomb-proof as a type V, it's much,
> | much safer than a vest stored in a locker. Also, a squirt vest is
> | much easier to swim in that a conventional vest. In the Winter I wear
> | my squirt over my 5/3 mil hooded wetsuit and it makes for a pretty
> | good poor man's mustang suit.
> |
> | Look up Northwest River Supply and you should be able to find a squirt
> vest.
> |
> | YIBB,
> |
> |
> | CRUMBLING EMPIRE PRODUCTIONS
> |http://www.crumblingempire.com
> | (212) 243-1636
> |
> |
> | Bolger rules!!!
> | - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> | - no flogging dead horses
> | - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> | - stay on topic and punctuate
> | - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> |
> |
> |
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
There are several of the sospenders brand models available.
Would someone make a reccommendation?  I am looking
to buy one, but have never seen one used.
 
James Fuller
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent:Saturday, February 10, 2001 2:41 PM
Subject:Re: [bolger] PFDs

As a reformed squirt boater, I've got a few of these. They are comfortable
as David says, albeit a bit hot in the summer if you are not swimming some.


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Ryan" <david@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] PFDs


| >thanks for the quick reply, Steve... I have been thinking about them for
| >this years sailing season... But have not talked to anyone that has
| >experience with them inflating....
| >  I always wear a regular PFD but it is uncomfortable and very hot in the
| >late summer.......
| >while I am a good swimmer not everyone that sails with me is... would you
| >say that they are suitable for non swimmers?
| >thanks
| >Chris Flynn
|
|
| Chris, you've pointed out the biggest reason why PFDs don't get used
| -- they really get in the way.
|
| I may have an answer.
|
| There's a sub-set of kayaking called "Squirt-boating." Squirts spend
| as much time under the water as on top, and a big-bulky vest really
| gets in the way.
|
| There's a Type III vest made just for this kind of activity. I have
| one and use it all the time. Not quite as nice as no vest at all, but
| whenever I'm doing something with my boat that I wouldn't do on my
| surfboard, (way off the beach,) I wear the vest. (I also have a very
| loud whistle permanently affixed.)
|
| Another handy self-rescue item is a pair of flippers. In Hawaii, guys
| who surf *really* big waves tuck a single flipper into their wetsuits
| just incase they have to make a long swim back to the beach. A few of
| the guys that kayak-fish out here carry them just incase.
|
| Although a type III vest is not as bomb-proof as a type V, it's much,
| much safer than a vest stored in a locker. Also, a squirt vest is
| much easier to swim in that a conventional vest. In the Winter I wear
| my squirt over my 5/3 mil hooded wetsuit and it makes for a pretty
| good poor man's mustang suit.
|
| Look up Northwest River Supply and you should be able to find a squirt
vest.
|
| YIBB,
|
|
| CRUMBLING EMPIRE PRODUCTIONS
|http://www.crumblingempire.com
| (212) 243-1636
|
|
| Bolger rules!!!
| - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
| - no flogging dead horses
| - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
| - stay on topic and punctuate
| - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
|
|
|




Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
- no flogging dead horses
- add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
- stay on topic and punctuate
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts

Safe boating in a Bolger boat is a list topic.

I have had a standing rule for years, nobody out of the cabin without a PFD.

I would think one worn by a non swimmer is a lot better than a regular one
not worn because of discomfort. The comment about going home with one on
because speaks well for the non intrusiveness of inflatables.

One of the most important things with safety equipment is training. Buy some
extra CO2 cartridges and head for the pool. You react in an emergency as you
have been trained, and if you haven't trained then you have to rely on
thinking clearly while your scared and maybe hurt.

manta@...wrote:

> I realize that this in not a bolger topic... but I would like to
> know if any one in this group has had any experience with inflatable
> PFDs?
> thanks
> Chris Flynn
> Flynn's Folly
> _/)

_ _ _ _ _
% Harrywelshman@...
As a reformed squirt boater, I've got a few of these. They are comfortable
as David says, albeit a bit hot in the summer if you are not swimming some.


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Ryan" <david@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] PFDs


| >thanks for the quick reply, Steve... I have been thinking about them for
| >this years sailing season... But have not talked to anyone that has
| >experience with them inflating....
| > I always wear a regular PFD but it is uncomfortable and very hot in the
| >late summer.......
| >while I am a good swimmer not everyone that sails with me is... would you
| >say that they are suitable for non swimmers?
| >thanks
| >Chris Flynn
|
|
| Chris, you've pointed out the biggest reason why PFDs don't get used
| -- they really get in the way.
|
| I may have an answer.
|
| There's a sub-set of kayaking called "Squirt-boating." Squirts spend
| as much time under the water as on top, and a big-bulky vest really
| gets in the way.
|
| There's a Type III vest made just for this kind of activity. I have
| one and use it all the time. Not quite as nice as no vest at all, but
| whenever I'm doing something with my boat that I wouldn't do on my
| surfboard, (way off the beach,) I wear the vest. (I also have a very
| loud whistle permanently affixed.)
|
| Another handy self-rescue item is a pair of flippers. In Hawaii, guys
| who surf *really* big waves tuck a single flipper into their wetsuits
| just incase they have to make a long swim back to the beach. A few of
| the guys that kayak-fish out here carry them just incase.
|
| Although a type III vest is not as bomb-proof as a type V, it's much,
| much safer than a vest stored in a locker. Also, a squirt vest is
| much easier to swim in that a conventional vest. In the Winter I wear
| my squirt over my 5/3 mil hooded wetsuit and it makes for a pretty
| good poor man's mustang suit.
|
| Look up Northwest River Supply and you should be able to find a squirt
vest.
|
| YIBB,
|
|
| CRUMBLING EMPIRE PRODUCTIONS
|http://www.crumblingempire.com
| (212) 243-1636
|
|
| Bolger rules!!!
| - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
| - no flogging dead horses
| - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
| - stay on topic and punctuate
| - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
|
|
|
When you get to considering the question of auto-inflation or manual
inflation, you may ponder the following unhelpful experience: I have
friends who race and sail a lot, and they have some of each, and they
have experienced accidental inflations from both kinds. The one might
catch a splash of spray, the other might catch on the rigging.

The first guy in our fleet who got them said his biggest problem was
that crew members wore them home because they forgot they had them
on.

Peter
In a message dated 2/10/2001 11:11:38 AM Eastern Standard Time,
manta@...writes:

<< would you
say that they are suitable for non swimmers? >>

Definitely not. S
>thanks for the quick reply, Steve... I have been thinking about them for
>this years sailing season... But have not talked to anyone that has
>experience with them inflating....
> I always wear a regular PFD but it is uncomfortable and very hot in the
>late summer.......
>while I am a good swimmer not everyone that sails with me is... would you
>say that they are suitable for non swimmers?
>thanks
>Chris Flynn


Chris, you've pointed out the biggest reason why PFDs don't get used
-- they really get in the way.

I may have an answer.

There's a sub-set of kayaking called "Squirt-boating." Squirts spend
as much time under the water as on top, and a big-bulky vest really
gets in the way.

There's a Type III vest made just for this kind of activity. I have
one and use it all the time. Not quite as nice as no vest at all, but
whenever I'm doing something with my boat that I wouldn't do on my
surfboard, (way off the beach,) I wear the vest. (I also have a very
loud whistle permanently affixed.)

Another handy self-rescue item is a pair of flippers. In Hawaii, guys
who surf *really* big waves tuck a single flipper into their wetsuits
just incase they have to make a long swim back to the beach. A few of
the guys that kayak-fish out here carry them just incase.

Although a type III vest is not as bomb-proof as a type V, it's much,
much safer than a vest stored in a locker. Also, a squirt vest is
much easier to swim in that a conventional vest. In the Winter I wear
my squirt over my 5/3 mil hooded wetsuit and it makes for a pretty
good poor man's mustang suit.

Look up Northwest River Supply and you should be able to find a squirt vest.

YIBB,


CRUMBLING EMPIRE PRODUCTIONS
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 243-1636
thanks for the quick reply, Steve... I have been thinking about them for
this years sailing season... But have not talked to anyone that has
experience with them inflating....
I always wear a regular PFD but it is uncomfortable and very hot in the
late summer.......
while I am a good swimmer not everyone that sails with me is... would you
say that they are suitable for non swimmers?
thanks
Chris Flynn
:
>
> << I realize that this in not a bolger topic... but I
>
> We have four stearns inflatables - three pouches and one set of
suspenders.
> And - we needed them once. The pouch overinflates and is a bit difficult
to
> fit over the head - which is why we bought my wife the suspenders. She
finds
> the suspenders to be more comfortable than the pouch since it's less bulky
> and doesn't slide around on the waist. They worked well. The only problem
we
> have - is that the small plastic piece which fits into the arming device
is
> very fragile - when that piece is missing it is suppose to be an
indication
> that the co2 tube needs to be replaced - and that small plastic piece
does
> break off and fall out while the co2 is still good. So - when it's missing
> you don't know if it's because the co2 cartridge needs replacing or
because
> someone threw the pouch down into the cabin. The day we needed it - my
wife
> was a bit in a panic and forgot to pull the rip cord - and I needed to
swim
> over and pull it.
>
> On the plus side - no one objects to wearing them because they are not
> awkward feeling - nor are they hot in the summer.
>
> No one is allowed in our boat without one on .
> Steve
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
>
>
In a message dated 2/10/2001 10:31:08 AM Eastern Standard Time,
manta@...writes:

<< I realize that this in not a bolger topic... but I would like to
know if any one in this group has had any experience with inflatable
PFDs?
thanks >>

We have four stearns inflatables - three pouches and one set of suspenders.
And - we needed them once. The pouch overinflates and is a bit difficult to
fit over the head - which is why we bought my wife the suspenders. She finds
the suspenders to be more comfortable than the pouch since it's less bulky
and doesn't slide around on the waist. They worked well. The only problem we
have - is that the small plastic piece which fits into the arming device is
very fragile - when that piece is missing it is suppose to be an indication
that the co2 tube needs to be replaced - and that small plastic piece does
break off and fall out while the co2 is still good. So - when it's missing
you don't know if it's because the co2 cartridge needs replacing or because
someone threw the pouch down into the cabin. The day we needed it - my wife
was a bit in a panic and forgot to pull the rip cord - and I needed to swim
over and pull it.

On the plus side - no one objects to wearing them because they are not
awkward feeling - nor are they hot in the summer.

No one is allowed in our boat without one on .
Steve
I realize that this in not a bolger topic... but I would like to
know if any one in this group has had any experience with inflatable
PFDs?
thanks
Chris Flynn
Flynn's Folly
_/)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~